seen a few places

[solarbird]

Taking Your Money Anyway

Comments

[elfs.livejournal.com]

So, what is the difference between the $25 billion bailout to the auto makers and the $1 trillion (give or take) that we've given to the financial industries? Is it that cars are tangible goods and we (collectively; I have a middling-poor grasp) don't understand the financial industry problems? Is it that the process is different, and the ripping of auto execs has a higher profile than the ripping of Citibank CEOs?

Where is that perpwalk, anyway?

[solarbird]

You might remember I spent a lot more time opposing the financial industries bailout than I spent opposing this, mostly because a this point this is chicken feed.

I think one popular-image difference is that people do really really want credit - it was too much willingness to take credit on that got us where we are - and people have demonstrated that they aren't actually real fond of these vehicles. I think another is that the other people were first and got away with more than they would've if someone else had come before them to crank up the rage. I think a third is that banks going under mean YOU LOSE YOUR MONEY (even when you don't) and that people tie the financial industry into the equities markets in their minds, and saw the financial bailout as a way to save their 401(k)s. Wrong, but, well, I can see it. I think a fourth is that a lot of people had this idea that if their lending bank went under, they lost their houses. This is of course also very wrong, but I heard a lot of that on call-in shows. The hosts would correct the caller, but for everyone one who thought that and was smart enough to ask, I suspect dozens more thought that and didn't check.

Meanwhile, relatively few people see "crappy car makers go under" as having those sorts of ramifications.

That's the speculation on my part, anyway.

[elfs.livejournal.com]

It's a myth, though, that Ford, at any rate, made "crappy" cars. Their cars regularly rated very high in customer satisfaction; higher, even, than Subaru. I love my Ford Escort; the damn thing just won't die no matter how badly I mistreat it. They made too many SUVs, and upper management just didn't move fast enough.

As a capitalist, I think that's cause enough to see them fail, but I'd hate to have people dis the manufacturing and engineering lines just because management was f*cked to the high heavens.

[solarbird]

Ford's also the most likely to survive even just on its own. So.

[interactiveleaf.livejournal.com]

That's why, two months ago, I bought Ford stock. I'm using the "20 year plan" to check my theory on its eventual value.

[technoshaman.livejournal.com]

Ford *did* make crappy cars for a while; see also, late '80's-early '90's Taurus (and Aerostar - same chassis/powertrain) with a transaxle that regularly failed at 70k. *like clockwork*. Because it simply wasn't up to the torque that the small-block 8 they put on top of it. They got their act back together but they're still not up there with the Japanese or the Germans for bang-for-buck. They had to license the Hybrid Synergy tech to make the Escape Hybrid; couldn't come up with it on their own. (Likely had ExxonTexacoChevronMobilBPShell got wind of it as an independent development, they'd have killed it.)

I will admit they did wonders for the Jaguar line; ditching the old Lucas electrics for Motorcraft made it possible to own just one Jag and still be able to drive it (I hope their new Indian corporate overlords don't screw that up)... but still. Rather have a Subaru or a Toyota or a Hyundai than a Ford.

[vixyish.livejournal.com]

I had a fabulous Escort too, that lasted me ages.

I asked tfabris about this once, because he has spent a lot of time paying attention to this, and because I was perplexed by the "Found On Road Dead" and "Fixed Or Repaired Daily" jokes that I kept hearing-- had I just gotten extremely lucky, or what? Turns out there was a period of time during which American car makers were learning from and copying the best technology of Japanese cars, particularly in terms of durability, and mine (and probably yours) appeared to have been made within that time frame.

Then there was a period of time when they *weren't*, and the quality fell.

[stickmaker.livejournal.com]

Just check how hard management tried to sabotage the new Mustang. Which is still one of their best selling cars, even with a revised version coming out next year.

[elfs.livejournal.com]

Oh, and I'm perfectly aware of your take on the matter. I just don't know why the press (and the blogosphere, too) thinks this is more interesting than watching Lurch Henry Paulson shackle our children to the national debt for all eternity.

[shadesofmauve]

I think it really is that the financial mess is too big for most people to wrap their heads around, is much more arcane, and makes people panic. The big 3 is a more straightforward example of How To Lose At Capitalism that we can all understand and deride. Not to mention that people have personal, 2 a.m. in the snow on the side of the freeway experiences with shitty cars. They're not GOOD reasons to focus more on this issue than the financial bailout, but they're understandable.

[backrubbear.livejournal.com]

There's also the fact that the Big 3 going under translate more immediately into direct unemployment. Financial organizations going under are harder to understand.

[solarbird]

And, yeah, perpwalks. Perpwalks happen when there's law. We don't have law.

[dustin-00.livejournal.com]

The GM CEO story keeps getting more and more entertaining.

Congress: We'll give you the money, but your CEO has to go.

Richard Wagoner: I have experience!

Congress: While Toyota was introducting the Prius you brought what to market?

Richard Wagoner: I have people skills! I know the auto industry! Why can't you people see that?

Congress: The answer, Mr. Wagoner, is the Hummer. So what is your auto industry experience telling you to do next?

Richard Wagoner: Beg congress for a $2,000,000 annual bonus?

Congress: Good-bye, Mr. Wagoner.

[flashfire.livejournal.com]

[anna-copperowl.livejournal.com]

I am personally still irritated that GM stopped selling the Geo Metro. I had three of these over the years, and the last one is coming up on 300,000 miles. We need more three-cylinder cars. I think the Smart car is the only one currently available in the US but due to modifications for the US market, its fuel economy is far less than the Smart models that can be purchased in other parts of the world. Mutter mumble grumble.