getting around
Sep. 15th, 2007 04:57 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
solarbirdEverybody talks about the Japanese train system. I have to say it's for damned good reason. They're fast, they're pleasant, they're on time; what else could you want?
Oh, I know - how about comfort, and room? Everybody knows how packed Japanese trains are, right?
How About That Legroom?
That's on a しんかんせん７００, the highest-speed class of "bullet train" currently running. (They have faster ones in testing now.) Note how Anna has her bag in front of her instead of in the overhead racks, or the luggage storage areas at the back of each car. Note also that the train is in motion, and I'm standing, taking pictures. What you can't see is that I could have stood up in front of my own seat and been at full height, or that this is ordinary class, not a green (first class) car. And it wasn't a reserved car saved for us. We had ordinary seat assignments, but that was it.
Here's what it looks like out a window of one of these trains. I don't know whether we were at top speed when I took this shot; the comfort level of the ride didn't really change with speed. The occasional vertical blinky blurs going by horizontally are utility poles.
Note how much quieter it is than an airplane. Note also that you can walk back to the bathrooms, complex of vending machines, or other cars at any time. Note that we didn't have to arrive at the station two hours in advance, and that we just walked onto the train. I spent some time updating my print journal while on the ride; it's far smoother than air travel, and while there are seatbelts they encourage you to use, they're optional.
We rode a 500 series - slower than the 700, but still high-speed - away from Tokyo ahead of the typhoon. Here's video of Anna updating her journal on the 500 during the ride through the leading edges of a typhoon. On the 500, it just seemed like another rainy day.
But it's not just the しんかんせん lines. The ordinary JR lines are also very comfortable. Not nearly as fast, of course, and on some lines the rails aren't welded - but even on those, there's not really much of the clacky-clacky noise. And below that, the light rail - those are more like a subway (side-seats only, lots of standing room), but again are 1. quiet, 2. clean, 3. on time, and 4. easy to figure out once you understand how the maps work. And everywhere, at least in and near the cities.
Our JR Rail run to Kansai Airport was three minutes late to the station due to weather. They issued apologies over the PA system while the cleaning crew did a mid-day spot-check clean of some of the cars. We got to the airport on schedule, to the minute. Oh, and by the way, they're good at stops and starts, like you'd want - there's nothing jerky about anything.
JR Rail to Kansai Airport, at station
I do want to say that the Seattle bus tunnel - at least, pre-closing, I've no idea what it'll be like under Sound Transit management - was one of the few transport hubs I've seen comparable to the nice Japanese subway stations. Hopefully ST won't screw them up. Sadly, here, they're the exception, and not at all the rule; I'd like to change that. Interestingly, they're also similar in that the individual stations tie several otherwise-independent blocks of retail together, with entry directly into those complexes. In particular, the bottom level of Westlake and the corresponding entry point to Westlake Station is probably the most Japan-like moment of transit station I've seen here. Add the ticket gates and it could be part of the system. Perhaps if I ever write fantasy fiction, I can have it be simultaneously a Sound Transit line station and a みなとみらい line stop. A transfer point between Seattle and Yokohama rails. There's even a Daiso on that level. It'd be great.
If only.
But back on topic. Rails met and exceeded all expectations, except for crowding. Those crowds you hear about certainly do exist, but not nearly to the extent suggested, and are a rush-hour phenomenon. I never saw it, but my friend Mariko told me they're real - mostly on the ring line in Tokyo, maybe, but real.
As with the food, though, there was a surprise: Japanese roads are also better. Smaller, sure. Much better sidewalked where appropriate, of course. And far fewer of them are really primarily intended for cars - most of the side-streets are pedestrian-first, cars certainly can and do come through but they need to be careful and slow. But the highways and major arterial routes - the car routes - are much smoother than here, and, accordingly, the bus rides are smoother and quieter. Not traffic-jam free, of course; our bus from Narita to Yokohama took almost twice as long as it should have, thanks to Tokyo rush hour traffic, and it was far and away the worst part of the trip, and pretty much the only portion I didn't enjoy. (We should have taken the train, but I didn't have that figured out yet. Now I do.) But at least the roads were smooth.
Getting back here - and onto 99 - reminded me of the time Anna's Norwegian pen-pal Yngvar flew in for a visit; we picked him up from the airport, and on the trip to Murkworks North, he was curious about the pavement treatment Seattle apparently used on I-5 to slow traffic down by making the ride have a strange vibration to it. "No," I said, "the roads just suck." Yngvar said, "...oh." and didn't bring it up again. I further speculate that someone from Japan would have had the same reaction. We may have a lot more roads than either of those countries, but they aren't really very good. "More," again, rather than "better," on roads. And both less - much less - and dramatically lesser on rail.
And even with really good roads, I prefer the trains. Somehow, I think the Japanese do, too:
Hato Bus
Oh, I know - how about comfort, and room? Everybody knows how packed Japanese trains are, right?
How About That Legroom?
That's on a しんかんせん７００, the highest-speed class of "bullet train" currently running. (They have faster ones in testing now.) Note how Anna has her bag in front of her instead of in the overhead racks, or the luggage storage areas at the back of each car. Note also that the train is in motion, and I'm standing, taking pictures. What you can't see is that I could have stood up in front of my own seat and been at full height, or that this is ordinary class, not a green (first class) car. And it wasn't a reserved car saved for us. We had ordinary seat assignments, but that was it.
Here's what it looks like out a window of one of these trains. I don't know whether we were at top speed when I took this shot; the comfort level of the ride didn't really change with speed. The occasional vertical blinky blurs going by horizontally are utility poles.
Note how much quieter it is than an airplane. Note also that you can walk back to the bathrooms, complex of vending machines, or other cars at any time. Note that we didn't have to arrive at the station two hours in advance, and that we just walked onto the train. I spent some time updating my print journal while on the ride; it's far smoother than air travel, and while there are seatbelts they encourage you to use, they're optional.
We rode a 500 series - slower than the 700, but still high-speed - away from Tokyo ahead of the typhoon. Here's video of Anna updating her journal on the 500 during the ride through the leading edges of a typhoon. On the 500, it just seemed like another rainy day.
But it's not just the しんかんせん lines. The ordinary JR lines are also very comfortable. Not nearly as fast, of course, and on some lines the rails aren't welded - but even on those, there's not really much of the clacky-clacky noise. And below that, the light rail - those are more like a subway (side-seats only, lots of standing room), but again are 1. quiet, 2. clean, 3. on time, and 4. easy to figure out once you understand how the maps work. And everywhere, at least in and near the cities.
Our JR Rail run to Kansai Airport was three minutes late to the station due to weather. They issued apologies over the PA system while the cleaning crew did a mid-day spot-check clean of some of the cars. We got to the airport on schedule, to the minute. Oh, and by the way, they're good at stops and starts, like you'd want - there's nothing jerky about anything.
JR Rail to Kansai Airport, at station
I do want to say that the Seattle bus tunnel - at least, pre-closing, I've no idea what it'll be like under Sound Transit management - was one of the few transport hubs I've seen comparable to the nice Japanese subway stations. Hopefully ST won't screw them up. Sadly, here, they're the exception, and not at all the rule; I'd like to change that. Interestingly, they're also similar in that the individual stations tie several otherwise-independent blocks of retail together, with entry directly into those complexes. In particular, the bottom level of Westlake and the corresponding entry point to Westlake Station is probably the most Japan-like moment of transit station I've seen here. Add the ticket gates and it could be part of the system. Perhaps if I ever write fantasy fiction, I can have it be simultaneously a Sound Transit line station and a みなとみらい line stop. A transfer point between Seattle and Yokohama rails. There's even a Daiso on that level. It'd be great.
If only.
But back on topic. Rails met and exceeded all expectations, except for crowding. Those crowds you hear about certainly do exist, but not nearly to the extent suggested, and are a rush-hour phenomenon. I never saw it, but my friend Mariko told me they're real - mostly on the ring line in Tokyo, maybe, but real.
As with the food, though, there was a surprise: Japanese roads are also better. Smaller, sure. Much better sidewalked where appropriate, of course. And far fewer of them are really primarily intended for cars - most of the side-streets are pedestrian-first, cars certainly can and do come through but they need to be careful and slow. But the highways and major arterial routes - the car routes - are much smoother than here, and, accordingly, the bus rides are smoother and quieter. Not traffic-jam free, of course; our bus from Narita to Yokohama took almost twice as long as it should have, thanks to Tokyo rush hour traffic, and it was far and away the worst part of the trip, and pretty much the only portion I didn't enjoy. (We should have taken the train, but I didn't have that figured out yet. Now I do.) But at least the roads were smooth.
Getting back here - and onto 99 - reminded me of the time Anna's Norwegian pen-pal Yngvar flew in for a visit; we picked him up from the airport, and on the trip to Murkworks North, he was curious about the pavement treatment Seattle apparently used on I-5 to slow traffic down by making the ride have a strange vibration to it. "No," I said, "the roads just suck." Yngvar said, "...oh." and didn't bring it up again. I further speculate that someone from Japan would have had the same reaction. We may have a lot more roads than either of those countries, but they aren't really very good. "More," again, rather than "better," on roads. And both less - much less - and dramatically lesser on rail.
And even with really good roads, I prefer the trains. Somehow, I think the Japanese do, too:
Hato Bus
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no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 12:12 am (UTC)In particular, the bottom level of Westlake and the corresponding entry point to Westlake Station is probably the most Japan-like moment of transit station I've seen here.
You might enjoy the whole huge complex under downtown Chicago that joins the commuter rail, the el, Marshall Field's, etc. Though that's more an "avoiding the weather outside" thing, it has some similar aspects.
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 12:13 am (UTC)I got to experience the salaryman crush on Tokyo trains one morning, and also the corresponding crush on the last train out on a weekend from Shinjuku, full of drunk teenagers and 20-somethings.
During the typhoon slowdown in Nagoya, there were JR employees everywhere with megaphones apologizing constantly and telling people where to go. And everyone was calm and non-irritated, as far as I could tell. And then my flight from LA to Dallas was delayed 2 hours, and we were given NO information on it or why it was delayed until boarding time, and everyone was really angry. The difference in attitudes was amazing. I'd really like to see more apologies from companies at times like these, but in our litigation-happy society, they're afraid it's an admission of guilt, so we don't get them, which makes everyone even crankier.
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 12:14 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 06:47 pm (UTC)I wonder if that's the album name we've been looking for to go with this band we invented named Bullet Train Typhoon. This is the picture for their first CD. ^_^
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 06:51 pm (UTC)Also
Date: 2007-09-17 05:22 am (UTC)So, what's the crush like? Is it as insane as it sounds? Tell!
(Godt dammit elf needs good rail system badly! The Cascadian line is much better than typical Amtrak because British Columbia, Washington, and Oregon pay extra to make it happen, and rail improvements are - slowly - working their way down the line, but that's only the barest start in the grand scheme of things.)
Re: Also
Date: 2007-09-17 12:57 pm (UTC)For the Shinjuku drunken-people crush, it was just like that as well, only everyone was in a better mood and sparklier clothing. :) And when the train took a curve pretty fast, half of the people standing in the car fell over and we all burst out laughing. And there was a space in the train car right around the door farther down, and when we got off the train we discovered it was because someone had thrown up right against the door and on the floor in front of it. And a very happy drunken Japanese young man kept asking Rachel if she was all right every time the train swayed.
Re: Also
Date: 2007-09-17 12:59 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 12:30 am (UTC)But since We would rather Not Pay the Taxes, we get what we pay for.
And since their government is Not Scaring Everyone into believing there is a Terrorist at Every Corner, they don't have the security hassles we have here.
Remember, it's real hard to hijack at train (though terrorists have done nasties to Japanese and English trains/undergrounds). So the security is just usually looser.
Though the US Airlines have noticed that people tired of the two hour lines are taking trains more often (especial the NorthEast Corridor). They are pushing to airline security for the train system. After all, if the Trains have a 2 hour line, then people won't take them as much. *ARRGGHH*
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 01:13 am (UTC)It's all about not being willing to pay for civilization. You spend second-rate amounts of money on public infrastructure, and you end up with a second-rate country. That's basically what we are right now (at best) unless and until we turn things around. I bet the bridges in Japan aren't falling apart like ours are, either.
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 05:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 07:46 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 03:01 am (UTC)That's *coach*? Wow, that looks like Business Class here... I like taking Amtrak to places where they run, it's just that (a) they only run 80mph here and (b) they don't run where I want them to atall. (Nice shot there, too, BTW :)
*sigh* If we could just instill their sense of quality over here without bringing with it their attitude about foriengers...
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 08:56 am (UTC)On the other hand: Anywhere, almost anytime (shut down for a couple of hours in the middle of the night, still some service then on weekends), always on time, and a very easy to understand system, even if you don't speak German.
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 01:39 pm (UTC)Yeah, but could *I* have stood up straight in front of the seat? :-^)
no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 06:37 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-16 08:54 pm (UTC)And that is an incredible amount of legroom, although I hear the long-distance trains are pretty expensive (possibly even by UK standards). One of my problems with the otherwise quite swish high-speed trains on the line that runs here is that they are a bit cramped. (The other problem is that the windows aren't as big as on older trains, meaning many seats don't have a proper view and the whole thing feels darker. Just based on your photo, that Japanese train looks better than our new ones, but not as good as the old ones, on that score.)
Actually, over the last decade or so, the UK train system overall is gradually starting to seem fairly modern (at least the trains, if not the rails and signalling) - hey, we've just built the high-speed link to the Channel Tunnel! (Don't anyone mention that it's the only purpose-built high-speed track in the country, or that the French had their high-speed line available on the day the tunnel opened. Still.)
Travelling by train is incredibly nicer than plane because of the whole airport experience. Having been to Paris on Eurostar, I'd would never go any other way. Of course, it's more expensive than going by plane, which means not everyone makes that decision. :( (Especially for longer journeys - connecting at Paris for elsewhere in the continent - which are possible but obviously can take rather longer because of the distances involved.)
no subject
Date: 2007-09-17 05:12 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-09-17 02:48 pm (UTC)For the rush hour, I think that is usually morning and evening on the Yamanote-sen. I think I probably only saw it at evening time when I visited.